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Please share your thoughts
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 Post subject: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 10:20    


Suugar-Fiend

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I've been kinda hesitant to make this thread. As I can kind of feel how some might react to this......but here goes.

Don't get me wrong..I LOVE the perk system. I think it's amazing and a great idea.
The only thing I am finding discouraging about the whole process is the items. I am not sure if anyone else thinks this way, but I have occasionally saved enough money to donate enough to receive the queen's gift because it was a "fancier" item. I know donating is for the good of the site, but the truth is those items did offer an extra incentive to donate more. At least for me.
I'm a college student, kind of eating ramen everyday so when a GOTQ item came out that I really wanted. I pulled the extra strings to make it happen. It wasn't something easy for me to do. I know this might not be the exact situation everyone is in, but I'm sure money is tight all around.

That being said, the current perk items that have been offered have been very disappointing to me. They reminded me a lot of "lost items" more then "queen" items. Not that lost items aren't great that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that I'm used to seeing the Queen's gift being more "queenly". You know?. I wish these perk items looked like items a Queen might wear.

The problems with the items as I see it:
:ql: They are disjointed, they do not look like items that could be in a set. I think they could benefit from some cohesion. Its what makes them look so "lost item-ish" in the first place because the current ones have no real cohesion.

:ql: They need more details.Each item should be a Jewel in it's own right. Something that would make me feel like "man i GOTTA HAVE THOSE". The old GOTQ LOOKED like they were worth 1mil food. But these ones don't do that for me. Let me put it this way......it's like if you had to choose which store would the current GOTQ go to? bananarama or Lunatic Fridge? I think most people would say bananarama. Or Rikashitsu for the small wing item and cat ears.
I shouldn't be thinking that....I should be thinking TT but GRANDER. Like it came from the GODS..... :mctongue:. Like if you tried to look up queen items now the only reason you know they are queen items is bcs they have queen in the name. If not they would BLEND in, that's not the case with the old GOTQ, there was something UNIQUE to them.

Old GOTQ used to take old items from previous sets but made them GRANDER....added extra here, more hair there. I am sure Firn is kind of no stranger to making items "Fancier".

I guess the point is that....ever since the perk started the items haven't been worth getting for me. And I fear that might be how other users might feel as well. I know donation has been a big issue for a very long time and it's a complicated and complex problem. But this perk system was created as a means to help lessen some of that issue and I'm not sure it is.

I might be all wrong on this and Firn can prove me statistically wrong in this regard in terms of the amount of donations received since the perk system started.

But as I've seen it.....it hasn't. Since Firn is even opened commission work and special knuffels and all that. Somethings made things worse and this might be one of the things.

The perk system is great.....the ITEMS are the ones failing it. I know it's quite a bit more work to make items more detailed. But I think it's worth it.

I play this game on my phone called "LINE PLAY' and it's also kind of an avatar site per say just on an app. And I've been tempted to sell my stuff just to afford to get some of the items they offer. This app sucks in cash like i've seen few of this type of apps do but it is in part for the "fancy" items you have to pay to get. I'll include some pictures so show what I mean:
[x][x][x][x]

THIS ONE WAS ONE OF MY FAVORITE GOSH WHEN IT CAME OUT I DID SPEND TO GET IT:
[x][x]

They don't call them VIP for nothing and to this day I don't regret buying those items and it's what I wish the GOTQ items looked like/ did that for me again.

I know you work hard Firn and I don't mean to disrespect in any way. I just know that if i don't say anything I kind of might regret it. I've kinda been sitting on it for months now lol.

To the rest of the this lovely community feel free to leave your thoughts too.


{Edit}
I just saw this month's items and they suffer from the same problem as well......:mcsweat:.
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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 10:56    


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Firn

Joined: Apr 14th, '07, 00:58
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Thanks for making this tread - in parts I agree with you. Clearly the perk system is not working out and I don't have the feeling it's motivating anyone to donate more. (And do not worry, I don't feel disrespected in any way. Sometimes you put effort into something, but it still isn't working. That's life.)

However, I must say that I feel like this is motly people's perception. Let's take a look at the 20FC perks:

Image Image Image Image Image

And now let's look at some past Queen's gifts:

Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image

Comparing these, do you really believe the past queen's gifts were more "queenly" or "fancier"? Or are they not "disjointed" in the same way? Because I don't. They were gold, but they certainly were not more detailed or elaborated. I can assure you at least, that I certainly do not put less effort into the new perk items. (It's more the opposite, as I have to come up with completely new items, while the old queen gifts were just past items with tweaks. But you would be surprised: At the very beginning the Queen Gifts were also new items and they even were not always gold (Trumpet Vine Tattoo for example) and when I changed them to re-designing old items, some peopel said they were disappointed and the items did not feel special to them anymore! So it was pretty much the other way around.)

Though, in the end it probably does not matter whether it is just people's perception or really like this, the outcome is the same. :mcsad:

So, in my opinion, this is not the problem. Maybe the color is really the main difference, though why leaves me baffled, as I never had the impression that gold was one of the most popular items here. At least gold sets in for example the Treasure Trove never rank among the best-selling.

I am open to suggestions, I really am as I agree with you - People don't seem to like the items much and this needs to be reconsidered.
But right now I can't fully wrap my head around what exactly to change about them, because other than the color I am not really making anything different than before, so I don't understand the "not fancy", "not queenly" or "disjointed" aspect that people are feeling. So is it just details you think they are lacking?

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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 11:35    


Suugar-Fiend

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Phew....I am so glad you think so Firn. I have been sitting on this for months working up the courage to not think I was being dumb lol.

I know in the past GOTQ items were not exactly "cohesive" either....I guess the fact that they were the same color helped. But what I meant by that is something the current perk method could use, not that something the old GOTQ had....per say. I think they would look better if they looked like they belonged together. That way it kinda motivates people to collect the "Set" instead of just one item. But they don't have to.....but the temptation is there.....you know? I think GOTQ have always been about temptation for me. How much do I want it. And we have to try to bring that back...somehow.

I know you work just as hard (and more) now in making the perks as you did before. Sorry if I make it sound like you were somehow getting lazy on the items that's not what i meant. :mcheh:

I guess when i mentioned "fancier" I had......the TT items that were converted to GOTQ items in mind. Like the ones my avatar is wearing....the golden valkerie headwings, the golden vernadette dress, the swan headwings. If you put them by comparison to their TT counterparts, you added things that improved them in some way made them different and in my oppinion fancier. More detail. Unique. When i said those things i had those in mind lol.
---honestly haven't changed this avatar in months since i got the Valkerie headwings---
I guess "fancier" would be adding more "fluff", i guess? Decorative things like....for example if you added roses, pearls to the bunny ears to encompass the whole head. Or If you took this month's wings and added hanging diamonds streaked with pearls. Make them look.....expensive?
Gosh it's really hard to explain lol.

Exactly Firn....I think the problem is in the details. You are right.

I feel like i might get crucified for this example as most of us know how you feel about gaia online. But it's a site I know you were familiar with. You know how you could clearly tell which one were the "free" items, and which ones people dropped a shit ton of cash. Well the cash items if you remember at this point (haven't been there in year either lmao) were items that looked like Royalty would wear...or like an over the top anime character......like this [x] Imagine making a set that looked like the boy in the photo. Hair with wings like that and that black veil.
I found a set of gaia avatars: [x] I think #27#40 is specially expensive-looking lol.
Compare #2 and #3 which one of them looked like they spend cash on?
:mcwink: . I say clearly #3, but i hope you can see the difference?

I feel like GOTQ should be OVER THE TOP. Like A CIRQUE DE SOLEIL show. Items with like all the lace, star, moon, pears, flowers etc etc. SPARKLES..... It should kind of blow things out of the water.


You could even try simple animation with them? But that was a stretch idea for me. Just wanted to throw it out there......eyes closing, wings flapping, etc. But thats just food for thought as I know your swamped as it it. I just thought it would be cool for the future sometime out there :mctongue:

I have to go to sleep now....5am! But i just wanted to leave a response >.<. Just takes me so long to form all my thoughts lol. I hope other join with ideas soon too. It's why i said something in the announcements as I know all users get those and most likely to wonder over here. Hopefully :mccute:
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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 11:58    


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Firn

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So you think that all 4 donation perks of a month should have the same theme? Like a set? That would make things really difficult for me, because it is really hard to come up with themes for the Monthly Treasure and the Treasure Trove sets each month already. :mccry: I think by now I am spending more times coming up with the ideas than actually drawing the items, because after 10 years of making avatar items, a lot of ideas are already used up. :mcsweat:

I will try to make the 20FC donation perk item more detailed in the future. Let's see whether it will make a difference. ( I will leave the more minor perks as they are for now and focus on the main 20FC perk, because essentialy that is what is "replacing" the former queen's gifts.)

I think the "problem" (or what I considered to be a problem, not so sure about this anymore) with Gaia and the free items versus cash items was that, at least in my opinion, the free items were, sorry, shit. You could tell which items were free and wich were cash items, not (only) because they put a lot of work into the cash items, but because they did not put real effort into the free items. That has always been something that had been bugging me and therefore I try to put a lot of effort into free items as well. I believe many of our free items could easily have been part of a TT set as well. But that now seems to work in my disadvantage as it raises the expectations for other items. :qsweat:

I think animations are not possible. I don't understand why (as it works with room items), but starkad said it's not working for avatar items. I think it has something to do with the room items actually being all items loaded, while the avatar is "converted" into one single image for the forums.

Here is a completely different idea: Knuffel as donation perks? Would that be a good or bad idea?

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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 13:08    


Sonnentau

Joined: Jun 6th, '10, 13:59
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I like the donation packs but suugar has a point to
One time i have donated so that i could get the golden wedding dress XD
Would it maybe be an idea just to make the last item a golden Remake?

And i don't think knuffel as an perk is a good idea, would you make New one er use the older generations?

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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 13:48    


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Firn

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I guess I could make the 20FC perk like I always made the queen's gift, if that's what people want?


I was thinking of new Knuffel - Giving out old ones makes no sense to me as there is no logical way to do so - start with the oldest ones and work towards the newer so the perks become "worth" less each month doesn't seem like a logical idea.
But it's just an idea.

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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 14:06    


Sonnentau

Joined: Jun 6th, '10, 13:59
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People wants things for free XD

Even when this sounds mean but think about the way with the unique one, "collectors" are going to scream and cry and say what shit way is this. So i don't think knuffels are the best idea.
But i think too that are cute knuffel could bring some people to spend the minimum, when it is still are four item perk and the first "item" is the knuffel

I like the perks and i hope you will keep them this way.
Most of the time i like the last and second one, like this time and i hope to get the tattoo.

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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 14:19    


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Firn

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Sing along Songs wrote: Even when this sounds mean but think about the way with the unique one, "collectors" are going to scream and cry and say what shit way is this. So i don't think knuffels are the best idea.
But following that argumentation I basically could not make anything as donation perk that people actually "want" - Because with everything people want, the ones who won't be able to get it, will be unhappy. That would mean making something as donation perk that people don't want so they have nothing to complain about. :mcheh:
And that, in the end, isn't really helping. :mcheh:

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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 14:38    


Sonnentau

Joined: Jun 6th, '10, 13:59
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I know that my thoughts not really help
In the end, you must know what is the best for you
You can't make everyone happy
Maybe a little survey via annoucements could help

Ask them, i think so you get more feedback than in this topic
Some are shy and they would never say ouT loud what they think

But at the other side, it means more work for you -.-

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 Post subject: Re: A few thoughts on the perk items
Posted: Feb 1st, '18, 14:56    


Chrizine

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Just a short post to address this particular point for now, as I am on mobile and will soon be somewhere where I don't have Internet on my phone, I think I will make another post with my thoughts towards the perk items themselves soon.
Firn wrote:
So, in my opinion, this is not the problem. Maybe the color is really the main difference, though why leaves me baffled, as I never had the impression that gold was one of the most popular items here. At least gold sets in for example the Treasure Trove never rank among the best-selling.
Maybe the point is not that gold is people's favourite colour, but rather that it is a colour that a lot of people like to use in some combination. Off the top of my head I can think of:
Gold x scarlet
Gold x white
Gold x aqua
Gold x teal
Gold x Red
Gold x violet
... There's probably more.
So people who like any of these secondary colours would consider a nice item in gold alone, or even in gold x white (as quite a lot of the queen's gifts were), usable for themselves.
The tt sets with gold probably mostly feature one of these colour combos, so they don't target as many people's tastes as a pure gold item can.

For me, gold is not my favourite colour, but it is a colour that I like and know I can use, where some other colors that might be really popular with some people I'd never be interested in. So maybe the goal should not be to use a colour that is a lot of people's absolute favourite, but rather one that most people like enough to consider if they like the particular item, even though it is not their absolute favourite colour.

Maybe I'm way off with all of this, but that is what went through my head when thinking about this and I wanted to share the thoughts.

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