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Please pick two designes of your choice
Poll ended at Feb 10th, '11, 17:19
Image  1%  [ 13 ]
Image  9%  [ 98 ]
Image  4%  [ 39 ]
Image  2%  [ 24 ]
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Image  1%  [ 7 ]
Image  2%  [ 19 ]
Image  9%  [ 92 ]
Image  3%  [ 30 ]
Image  14%  [ 141 ]
Image  1%  [ 11 ]
Image  7%  [ 76 ]
Image  12%  [ 124 ]
Image  1%  [ 14 ]
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Image  10%  [ 103 ]
Image  4%  [ 38 ]
Image  2%  [ 18 ]
Image  7%  [ 68 ]
Total votes : 1034
 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 08:36    


AlkseeyaKC

Joined: Sep 12th, '08, 16:39
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COMPARE THIS AND STOP ACCUSING!!! PLEASE!! >_<;

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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 08:47    


Kiihay

Joined: Oct 22nd, '10, 21:33
Posts: 11
Hugs: 896
Mood: want to draw something for herself :? but what?
Location: Spokandi
Ziaheart wrote:I'm a mod, and I entered the contest. Is my entry up there? No. OMG bias LOLOLOL. Plus, the names are redacted in the poll. The only way to know which entry belongs to whom is to know their style/go through the long list in the previous announcement. I'm SURE that a lot of people are going through that right now in order to kiss ass. /sarcasm

Same-handed people often find it easier to draw the hair sweeping the same way. I overlayed previous Knuffel in order to get the positioning of nose, eyes, and lips correctly. I don't find it that startling that the overlay of the facial features line up, especially on computer graphic entries. Plus, the coat tail looks a bit like you're grasping at straws. That leaves the bubble and the pants, which could have been coincidental.

A LOT of people used fire on hand/feet idea, not just M o i and you, Kiihay. And I would think I would put off entering as long as possible if I didn't want people stealing my ideas. I've seen M o i's works a lot and he enjoys using heavily lined slanted eyes on his character. If we were truly hushing up this episode, we would delete all comments saying that M o i copied off of you and pretend this discussion never happened, as opposed to trying to explain it/work it out. It is my opinion that the original poster was told that way because of the way they were expressing themselves. There is a way to voice your concern without being so argumentative. I thank you for being professional that way, unlike your previous two advocates.


First and foremost your first comment/paragraph is the very reason I brought up the entire issue of unprofessionalism. Honestly a mod shouldn't be attacking a member with a serious problem like this. Especially when I tried to be as civil and polite as I could be in this situation. You say you are trying to explain and work it out but the entirety of your first paragraph was spiteful and unnecessary.

Also this is my first contest. I've never entered a contest this large before therefor, I thought going about it the way I did was the smart idea. I didn't think anyone would be that brash. I know I have learned a lesson in a very difficult and distressful way.

You address the issues that I could forgive let them be on individual basis. Combined this isn't just artistic ideas/freedoms that many people share but the basis of the ideas completely taken from one to the other even if executed differently.

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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 08:53    


Knuffel Moderator
Ziaheart

Joined: Jun 22nd, '08, 18:31
Posts: 12326
Hugs: 242994
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Examples of fire at hands/feet what, you thought I would make a claim and not back it up? What sort of university student do you take me fer?:

Hands:
http://i.imgur.com/HPtc1.png
http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n196 ... tsunes.jpg
http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee32 ... lbase1.png
http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk307/AgataBr/5.jpg
http://i53.tinypic.com/2dtbz4g.jpg
http://i872.photobucket.com/albums/ab28 ... 2whole.jpg
http://home.arcor.de/sharaselen/kofk/kn ... hoenix.png

Feet:
http://i778.photobucket.com/albums/yy66 ... 1290492240
http://i013.radikal.ru/1011/44/17f9abc50734.jpg
http://i1232.photobucket.com/albums/ff3 ... opy5-2.jpg
http://s014.radikal.ru/i329/1011/49/26c917fa89f1.jpg
http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n196 ... nuffel.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v678/ ... uffel5.png
http://oi53.tinypic.com/ekktwj.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a153/ ... s4c2-1.png
http://mavimiracle.com/bonus/knuffel.jpg
http://i53.tinypic.com/2u5urv4.jpg

Both:
http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n196 ... fel/FK.jpg
http://oekamie.planetkalzy.com/Extra/KnuffelEntry1.png
http://i51.tinypic.com/2v868fl.jpg
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb30 ... nuffel.jpg
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff4 ... loured.jpg
http://fc04.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2011/ ... 38far4.png

This is not including M o i's many entries, first of which was entered before yours. Do you think that this many people saw your entry and decided to take your idea of fire coming out of your hands and feet? I don't think it's very likely. I myself didn't really look at much of the entries until I got mine in, and in fact, didn't even see yours, Kiihay, until it was posted up there in the poll. I can honestly say that I only saw 8 of the entries up there before this thread was created, and that was because they were posted else where in the Kingdom, or I watch their devart page, etc. That's less than 50% of the entries. And since this concern is only coming out now, it seems you didn't really look at other people's entry, either. I'm sure a lot of people acted the same way. As for M o i though as a moderator, he's done some entry adding to the second post in the contest thread, but I looked through it, and the first moderator to move the entry to the second post after your entry was Shinji Fumajime. So it's possible that M o i didn't even see your entry until now, like me.

I'm sorry you feel so offended by this occurrence, but I seriously believe that M o i is not the type to do something like what you're accusing him of. Again, Only thing that I see that's too similar is the pants and coat-sleeve length, and I think even the coat-sleeve length is grasping from the fact that the two are different sleeves. And until I looked it up, I didn't even know which one were the entries in dispute, because though length of certain clothes item may be similar, the feel of the Knuffel themselves were different. Yours is an Oriental fox anthro Knuffel, and his is a... well, I'm not sure what his is (I want to say steampunk but that's only because of the spectacles, I suspect), but his look European to me. To me, they are two different Knuffel.

Also, Kiihay, the first paragraph wasn't directed at you, but the one before you who overlay the two art and used chtspk. In fact, only the last paragraph of that post you quoted was directed at you. I'm sorry for not making myself clear. I'm a bit of a Kantian in that way that I treat people the way people treat others. But that was out of line as a moderator. I apologize.

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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 08:54    


Telstel

Joined: Aug 1st, '08, 22:34
Posts: 509
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Mood: Demonic
Location: Australia
Oh this close, all entries are awesome, i didn't see my favourites in the list though T^T

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Please feel free to click on the links to chat to me, i'll be sure to get around to them when i can.
My Knuffel! Art Shop! Quest! Material Quest!
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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 09:01    


Moi

Joined: Jun 17th, '08, 21:48
Posts: 54000
Hugs: 514748
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Website: http://seppukuaddict.deviantart.com/
Location: \8u/

It's based off of your paranoia and high opinion of yourself that I'd go out of my way to copy your designs.
I don't know you nor do I care about your existence at all.

So you can just go on and be pissy and rant and rave about how I'm a
horrible person, who you don't even know by the way, and tell everyone I stole your ideas.

And go on and claim I won based on popularity.
Because that must be true just like the statement that I copied you.

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"I'll miss the winter
A world of fragile things
Look for me in the white forest
Hiding in a hollow tree (come find me)
I know you hear me,
I can taste it in your tears."



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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 09:48    


Xroalia

Joined: Dec 18th, '08, 01:29
Posts: 341
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Mood: RSI
Location: Kiwiland
Funny how the problem here is with the entry with the most votes and it was only brought up just now after the voting started ages ago. Just saying.
Whether there are similarities or not I fail to see how it is a copy.

I truly hope this drama doesn't jeopardise any future competitions.

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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 10:07    


Knuffel Moderator
Ziaheart

Joined: Jun 22nd, '08, 18:31
Posts: 12326
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Mood: *fingers crossed*
Location: Canada
M o i only entered one before Kiihays, and it had fire coming out if its hands. I don't know why this is coming up, though. No one said anything about this before me, and I thought I made it clear that the first one M o i entered was entered before Kiihay's was entered. M o i entered on Nov 22nd, '10, 20:44 (PST). Kiihay entered Nov 23rd, '10, 18:39 (PST). Many people entered before M o i and in between M o i's entry and Kiihay's entry. Are you going to claim that they were cheating, too?

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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 10:22    


Mikael Hart

Joined: Apr 16th, '07, 05:34
Posts: 18419
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Location: Lordship of Wuffel
I'm with Xroalia, I didn't even enter this time (which is a crying shame), but man, if this keeps going on, Firn wouldn't want to have any more contests again. Last time she put up a contest, there was also drama, good-grief; sometimes it seems like all this community can agree on is clicking events and free items.

Can we all just respect each other a little more, please? I didn't want to have to get into this because Firn implied that we all stop bickering and passing on the hate, but I guess if this thread isn't locked, there's going to be no end to that. Lemme just state a few things before then:

1. When members suspect a problem, they should report them to mods. If you don't trust mods, please, by all means, report them to the admin instead. I have known Firn since KofK was still on Gaia, and I trust her to handle matters professionally. She is fair when it comes to matters of the forum (and I have seen this on many occasions first-hand) and is not biased of mods over members. KofK is precious to her; she values us. Dude, aren't those free heart-things she just passed out proof enough? She's always working hard for our sake.

Reporting things privately would've helped KofK work more efficiently. Why's that? Well, it doesn't start up mob mentality and split people on two sides. It doesn't start drama or make people feel like victims. If Firn heard from enough people who came to their own conclusions that someone was copying, it would be more legit than having one person start up a riot because of tactlessness.

2. Also, members, mods, let's respect each other. Members tend to forget that mods have feelings too. From my experience of modding at several forums, I can tell you first hand that being a mod is hard work: there's always stuff to do, people yell at you (even when you try to be polite and handle things fairly), and you don't get paid. It's really, really, not a glamorous job, and if people say rude things to you, it's out of forum professionalism that you don't say rude things back.

Let's not accuse mods of being biased or saying they're in the wrong for entering these things. They aren't so different from members who volunteer to help the forum; is it wrong that they want to participate or win prizes too?


May we stick to what this thread is about and not try to heat this place up any further, amen.

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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 12:26    


Illustrator
Firn

Joined: Apr 14th, '07, 00:58
Posts: 5860
Hugs: 382147
Mood: [¬º-°]¬
Location: Utsusemi
    My head is spinning. X.x

    I will just add the two following things to my defense:

    1. I did with all honestly see no difference between these entries when I picked them. Yes, after you overlayed them, the look awfully similar. Maybe I am also seeing where your concern is coming from. I think this would happen to many designes though, simply because they are drawn on exactly the same base. It would probably also happen to lot of my own Knuffel.
    I could overlay random Knuffel and always find some similarities if you do it the way Norala did:
    Image
    Maybe it is not a similar as the two others, but it isn't even the exact same base, but there are still things that are similar.
    This is not the best example, but I want to get the idea across, how you find similarities when you overlay Knuffel.
    Yet I think that the design and idea behind these two Knuffel is still very different.
    I cannot judge whether the clothing was ripped off. I see similarities that could be on purpose, but could be sheer coincidence. I think Ziaheart pointed out a few good examples how the same ideas are recycled over and over again.
    I picked the entries because I both liked them, and I did not look after whether similar ideas were used for different entries, because a lot of the entries did use similar ideas, which is naturally to happen when you are provided with the same base and are given the theme of fire. I did not say "I will not take this one entry, because someone else already used the idea
    I am sorry this is causing so much uproar.
    Had I been aware that there were too much similarities (regardless on whether on purpose or not, again, I cannot judge this) I might not have picked it, mainly to avoid any drama. But I was simply not seeing it and even now, after similarities in the clothes are pointed out - and yes, they are there - I still think these are two completely different ideas.

    2. When I picked the entries I did the following - I saved them all to my harddisc and then went through them, picking the ones I liked - and at this point I just had files in front of me, named from entry 1 to entry X. So please do not say that " this is being over looked purely because it's this specific member" because when I picked them I was not even aware which entry was provided by which member.

    3. I do not understand why mods should not be allowed to participate in contests. They are members like everyone else, who in addition offer to help out moderating this site in their free time and have every right to use and enjoy this site like all other members. I think it would be unfair to take away the privilege to use an aspect of this site to them, just because they are helping out. It would seem like an punishment to me. A lot of people consider being a moderator a high privilege. I see it as dirty work. I love providing art and ideas for this site, I myself, utterly hate to have to administrate it and be responsible for everything. You would be surprised how much criticism and hatred you get for every decision you make. Mods suffer from the same. I have seen them being called names, being called lazy, unfair or being blamed for things that were never up for them to decide. I am very thankful that they are helping me and taking on sometimes unpleasant task and I do not want to punish them for it by saying "you mustn't take part in the contest". Above all, they are users like everyone else. You might think moderators are having an advantage because of their status, but they get a lot of unpopularity because of it too. Besides, I did not add the usernames to the entries, so, unless people went through the entries in the original contest submission thread, many users who vote here aren't even aware which entry was made by whom. So regardless of whether you think the idea was stolen, please do not say "it is being overlooked because he is a moderator". This is an unfair accusation.

    Again, I am sorry for all the drama and to all the grief this might have caused to anyone, may it be Kiihay or Moi or anyone else who might have felt treated unfair in this contest.
    I wish I never started this contest and there will not be any contests like this in the future.

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 Post subject: Re: Design a Knuffel Contest: Voting Round 1 !
Posted: Feb 10th, '11, 14:23    


AlkseeyaKC

Joined: Sep 12th, '08, 16:39
Posts: 23816
Hugs: 318193
Mood: I'm Blue dabadee dabadie.
Website: https://www.deviantart.com/alkseeyakc
Location: Lost out in a sea of mermen!
I knew it was going to happen and now that there's going to be no more, its making me cry a little. I had a lot of fun with this and was really looking forward to another contest. No I'm not upset with Firn and she didn't make me feel bad. She has every right to take them away after all thes commotion. I'm more upset at the people who brought up all this nonsense. Thanks for ruining it for us all.

The contest really did bring me a lot of happiness and joy. I would have liked it even if I didn't get picked.

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